47 replies to this topic

[Erratic_Knight]

So it's official the game will be released the 25th.

http://forums.darkfallonline.com/showthread.php?t=132003

I just want to say after waiting for this game for 6 years and being one of it's biggest advocates. After playing it for 3 weeks the game IS NOT READY.

Crafting requires a macro for hours and hours if you want to be successful or get anything. The Magic system is broken and forces you to grind the same spell over and over just to unlock others. They put up towers in the wilderness to protect new players creating safezones outside of the starting capitals. SAFEZONES are you fucking kidding me... Now seeing as how they haven't open up all of beta (unlocked all skills/mobs etc.) people could say there is still hope but i say stfu and get a clue. The dev's have been horrible at listening to tester feedback and at this point after my testing experiences it's clear that the the devs were under pressure to start making some actual money and because this is the world we live in the game its original ideas will suffer for it.

I'll let you know if there are any mega patches before release. Atm I don't know if I will buy DF. Simpy put, this isn't the game the Dev's told us it was and even worse it ISN'T FUN...

That's really all I feel like saying now. I'm too bummed...

[Giiizmo]

Wow, what a... shocker?

[bonedead]

Well I want to play, just dunno yet.

[mven]

NEW GAME. MUST BUY. SMASH.

[DesertedSoul]

Fanbois lose again. Yahaaaa
Seriously. EK If you remembered what we said about them shadowbane kids, you woulda took that to heart about this game.

sure maybe in a year or so it will get polished off. But honestly...who are we kidding?

[Nubs]

The whole safe tower thing is really blown out of proportion. The majority of the game has no towers, really the only areas that are protected are immediately outside major towns. There are still small outposts that have no towers and are open season for pkers. They essentially only protect very new players and they only protect the new players if they play smart. If they are dumb and let their life go too low, they will get ganked and wont be able to reach the guard tower.

edit: it's just like UO in that respect.

[Erratic_Knight]

The whole safe tower thing is really blown out of proportion. The majority of the game has no towers, really the only areas that are protected are immediately outside major towns. There are still small outposts that have no towers and are open season for pkers. They essentially only protect very new players and they only protect the new players if they play smart. If they are dumb and let their life go too low, they will get ganked and wont be able to reach the guard tower.

edit: it's just like UO in that respect.

It's more the principle of the fact that this game preached NO SAFEZONES...

My biggest gripe however is the simple fact the DF isn't fun and is a fucking korean grind fest. Oh sure it's optional but if you want any variety you better sure as hell grind.

For instance. You start with 2 spells. Manna Missile and Heal Self. If you want any other spells you have to level Lesser Magic Up to 25 (that gives you one or two conversion health to mana etc spells) and then to lvl 50 to Unlock Greater Magic. To level up lesser magic you have to use lesser magic spells so you have to cast MM and Heal Self about 5000 times to get it to be able to buy other spells. But it gets better. When you finay get to buy greater magic spells they aren't worth it initially because MM (since it's skill lvl is so fucking high from lvling it to raise lesser magic) is more efficient that the newly aquired spells which are at 1 skill lvl. So now I have to grind fucking Greater Magic Skills (which now cost regents) to be able to Unlock the elemntal spell school and apparently that's where the specialization and power comes into play. Oh except when you get there, you have to grind those spells to... Yeah and that's just magic...

How about crafting. This one is easy. Macro crafting or quit your job/life/everything. I'm not joking, don't bother doing ANY crafting at all unless you macro it. Ready, here is how you craft ANYTHING since it's all the same. Stand in front of a bush/tree/rock/oven/anvil/body of water/etc and equip your tool (fishing poll, saw, sickle, pick, etc.) and left click once. Now watch a meter fill up that takes 10 seconds. Congratulations you have just successfully or unsuccessfully depending on your skills lvl, performed the action you wanted. Now do that 5000 more times for each craft division. Boy is that shit fun...

What's left, melee... Melee's biggest problem was pot usage to restore stamina since that is the lifeforce of anyone meleeing. They fixed that by adding a cooldown. (This was a huge event. Imagine that, cooldowns...) So you all start with the same starter weapon but can swap it out for 20g (you can't lose your starter weapon when killed and you can purchase up to 3, but they are awful compared to real purchased or crafted ones). So you pick your weapon of choice which is pretty much a 2h weapon since block is broken and you circle straff around one another until you think you are going to die and then you run and try not to get shot in the back with an arrow or mm. Honestly, melee is the least broken of the systems imo but it gets stale because once again the abilities are useless until you grind them to a high enough lvl. But all and all I could live with melee being this way if the rest of the game wasn't suck fucked, because after all I have to aim my attacks and that shit is miles and miles better than any auto lock on system.

So what about boats and combat on them? I don't know, never got to test that stuff because you need to be in a huge guild making tons of money/getting lots of materials. But apparently it's in and works fine.

What about mounts? If you want your own you need to harvest steedgrass and buy 2 skills. SG is a pain in the ass to harvest so just buy if off someone but mounts in general are fast which is good, but you can only use a 1h weapon on them and they die very quickly.

Never did sieges so I have no idea...

All and all, I WILL prob buy darkfall but it will not be for at LEAST a month. I say that because once everyone who hasn't been in beta gets a chance to play than the devs are going to hear a shit ton of people bitching about the same things and then they will have two choices. Make the game they said they would make (because honestly it's a mater of tweaking the system not changing the whole game mechanics) or sink and shut down in 6months. Honestly if DF doesn't change there is no way it makes it a year. They are already trying to recoup costs by charging $53 for the download and $15 a month but it wont matter if no one pays after 4 months.

That's my review. I'm fucking pissed. Maybe I'll see you in game in a month...

[Nubs]

I understand your concerns but I really do think they just work slowly at making changes. I believe they will improve everything you just mentioned. I actually don't think anything is wrong with the gathering system as that is how UO did it. The crafting system needs some tweaking as it actually costs gold which I hate but yes there is room for improvement. The biggest question is: are there any better games out and I really don't feel there are.

[bonedead]

I feel like WoW and MMOs copying it have really warped our fragile little minds. Quests didn't used to exists, we used to think levels were gay and skill systems ruled all, and the only thing I can think of that caused this was WoW's quest driven system and how everyone had to copy it. I've noticed I'm not as hardcore as I used to be, but I've been trying to change that.

[Erratic_Knight]

I understand your concerns but I really do think they just work slowly at making changes. I believe they will improve everything you just mentioned. I actually don't think anything is wrong with the gathering system as that is how UO did it. The crafting system needs some tweaking as it actually costs gold which I hate but yes there is room for improvement. The biggest question is: are there any better games out and I really don't feel there are.

No not at all, no better games... But I will wait to see if it gets better and because waiting will bring about more info on the NA servers even though they have already said they will transfer us from the EU to NA servers when they launch them...

[Giiizmo]

Ow ow ow, thanks for the brutally honest synopsis, EK. Darkfall sounds a lot more like Darfail already.

I think that one of the fundamental flaws of Adventurine's concept of a 'skill-based' MMO is to treat skills just like tons of mini-levels for the players to grind. Instead, a proper skill-based game should offer its new players the ability to be a viable threat to any veteran player without having to grind anything at all.

Proper skill 'grinding' shouldn't have to be necessary to play a viable character but should instead offer extensive customization options. Also, the grind aspect should be lessened and punctuated by different 'levels of mastery' where the player should seek a master to train to the next level by completing a quest or a challenge relevant to his path of mastery as to further lessen the perceived notion of a grind.

Any game that requires old-school grinding and time sinks to keep their customers paying is flawed by design. That doesn't mean it can't be fun for a while but it will fail to create a permanent, living world for players since it'll always need to top itself with new loot and levels.

Bottom line: the 'leveling' part should be 'casual', the interaction with the world and the other players should be 'hard core'. Players would ultimately spend less time working to build their characters the way they please and more time fighting other players for resources, in-game objectives and whatnot. As long as game devs don't realize that, the MMO genre is bound to stagnate and we'll keep on moaning about how bad current MMOs are.

[bonedead]

If you want to play this game in a year (when it's tweaked and better) I suggest you buy it when it comes out.

[Giiizmo]

How about no? If I'm going to be 'investing' in a company, it'll be as a shareholder, not as a customer. What a whacked out concept, invest now so you can have fun later?

Let's look at it this way: they're a small team, they don't work fast, they make a lot of blunders, they make lots of promises they can't keep... and you want to help them?

[bonedead]

If it isn't able to sustain itself when do you think we will ever see this concept attempted again?

[Giiizmo]

Dunno, dun care. If a game company can't make an interesting game for me to play, I simply won't play. Lots of things to do other than sitting on your duff playing computer games anyway.

Besides, why do you think we're having so many WoW clones? That's because the guys in marketing figured that that's what the majority of players still want and so, that's where the big bucks are. The day the masses grow tired of the same old formula and game devs realize that they can spawn only so many derivative games before the market is saturated is when we'll start seeing some new stuff coming out. Then, and only then, will we see serious game companies try to innovate and try to fill out niches.

I don't know when it'll happen but it will. It's a concept that keeps repeating itself no matter the matter at hand. Take food for instance. Many decades ago, pizza and chinese food were still considered exotic. Then everyone opened up pizzerias and chinese restaurants and people grew tired of eating pizzas and chow mein all the time. Since then, people came up with 'raw', vegan, Japanese, French, Greek, 'nouvelle cuisine', healthy, unhealthy or themed restaurants and so on.

Not convinced? Just look at the myriads of porn niches there are nowadays. Thirty years ago we had Playboy and that was basically it.

[Nubs]

xactly what happened with shadowbane, the game was supposed to be better after a few months of release but it never happened. On the other hand, shadowbane felt like complete crap where as Darkfall feels like it just needs some tweaking.

[mven]

This doesn't really sound fun. Though I still think it's hilarious that some of you think a "skills" based system is really any different than a "level" based system. It's all grinding no matter what. It's just a matter of tweaking things to be faster be it with levels or with skills so you don't feel the grind. *shrug*

Anyway! I hope this is actually playable when it "releases" I am so going crazy without an MMO to play.

[bonedead]

I've gotta get it. I couldn't feel right posting here at PKER.org without supporting the ideals we love so dearly with my wallet. It takes 8 years for the opportunity to arise and depending on how this one does it may take another 8 years before we have this opportunity again.

I don't care if the game is a huge pile of dog shit. I've payed for worse. If the game sucks then I'll quit. But, the initial purchases are pretty much just investments in the ideals and features that Darkfall promises. Whether the developers deliver or not does not tarnish the ideals but tarnishes the developers. We all [are supposed to] want everything that Darkfall promises and the only way to show that is to buy it. Let the money truly reflect the interest so that people can see that we're not as niche as everyone acts like we are.

Giizmo I think what you say is true to an extent, but MMOs are not Pizza or Chinese food. If they are, tell me which Pizza shop or Chinese shop is supposed to be WoW? Which one is UO Pre-Trammel? Shadowbane? MMOs are a whole new beast. Games like Darkfall will start being made more often when investors see $$$$, that is what it all boils down to with MMOs, how much money you can milk them for. If investors see that 500k people purchase Darkfall, but only 50k actually pay for the next month, then it is possible for them to conclude that 500k people are interested in the ideals that Darkfall promises but since Aventurine poorly implemented those ideals they were not able to capitalize on them.

Once investors realize that they are not going to be able to attain WoW success they will begin looking at the niches and pick the one with the most $$$ thrown at it.

This is the only way we can let the MMO gods know what it is we want.

[bonedead]

http://www.mmorpg.com/blogs.cfm?isapi_rewr...3314&bhcp=1

From what I hear this is the "best Darkfall preview to date".

[Nubs]

They just released a patch today that reduced the time required to do crafting skills... I'll post the beta notes in the private forum.